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frequently asked questions
Can the Horseshoe Inn be a viable pub?

The Tweedales say that the Horseshoe cannot be viable as a pub. It is one of the main arguments they use to justify their closing it. But what are the facts?

When the Tweedales bought the pub, the estate agents, in their sales particulars, said: "The present owners have been operating as a free house for approximately 8 years during which time the business has been profitable. The business is however far from fully developed and offers tremendous scope for expansion…".

CAMRA believes that the Horseshoe can be viable. In the letters to the Forest of Dean concerning the recent planning application, several publicans and breweries expressed the view that the Horseshoe can be viable.

There are even now at least three people or groups of people who are prepared to buy the Horseshoe as a pub.

In their campaign to get the Horseshoe reclassified as a b&b, a large number of the Tweedales' supporters suggested that the Horseshoe could not be viable, and put forward as "evidence" the fact that the Beauchamp Arms is not viable. In fact, this is very wide of the mark; the Beauchamps is both successful and unsubsidised.

It was suggested that the Friends of the Beauchamp Arms subsidise the Beauchamps. Let's be clear about this: the Parish owns the pub; the 'landlord' of the pub is a tenant. As the pub's owner, the Parish has the responsibility to look after the fabric of the building. That's where the Friends come in: they are a group of local people who raise funds to improve the fabric of the Beauchamp Arms on behalf of the Parish.

Twenty of the letters in support of the Tweedales' planning application suggest that the Beauchamps is not viable, is heavily subsidised, or supported in some way. At least 12 of these letters were standard letters produced by the Tweedale camp. Clearly the supporters of the application were basing their support on wrong information.

The fact is that the Tweedales (or their supporters) are putting out stories that the Horseshoe (and even the Beauchamps) aren't viable. This is all false. The Beauchamps is a success and the Horseshoe can be.
But why was the pub unsold for 18 months?

The Horseshoe could have been sold, but it was priced rather high for a pub with a dismal trading record. It was worth a lot more as a private house, and the previous owners tried to sell it as such. At the time that the Tweedales bought the pub, there was another offer on the table at a slightly lower price from someone who wanted to run a pub.
Is there local support for the Horseshoe Inn as a pub?

Pub Evenings are organised by the Horseshoe Inn Campaign about four times a year. These try to reproduce a pub atmosphere, but in the village hall. They are supported by between 60 and 100 people - all of whom have, in the past, regularly used the Horseshoe.

When the Forest of Dean asked for comments about the Tweedales' recent planning application, over 150 people wrote in opposing the application - mainly on the gounds that they didn't want to lose their pub for ever.

The Tweedales put across the idea that it is Brooms Green which is the locality served by the Horseshoe. This is self-serving nonsense; the Horseshoe has always served a wider community than Brooms Green. If it were to be viable serving only 16 houses, they would need to be inhabited by alcoholics, and this was never the case. No: the Horseshoe is located in Brooms Green, but serves a much wider community. It is the people of this community who object in such large numbers to the Horseshoe being taken from them.
Why does HIC object to change of use?

A pub is a community asset; it is someone's private property, but it is limited by law to being a pub. Recently, house prices have risen to absurd levels, and it would now be very profitable to buy a pub and convert it to a private house. If this were allowed, there would be few pubs left, and that would mean a great loss to the community.

Of course, not all pubs will survive; some cannot be viable. But, the Horseshoe Inn is not one of them. With the right management, it would be viable.

If the Forest of Dean were to allow the change of use that the Tweedales want, the Dymock, Bromsberrow Heath and surrounding communities would lose an important community resource. This is why HIC (the Horseshoe Inn Campaign) was formed.

The Tweedales' latest planning application was for change of use to a bed and breakfast accommodation with a bar. Frankly, this concept is absurd; consider a few facts:
  • The Tweedales' application for change of use to private house and b&b was rejected in 2002; the recent application is hardly different to the 2002 application. If this application had been successful, it would have enabled the Tweedales to achieve change of use by stealth: they would not be bound to run a b&b or a bar actively. They would simply have a private house with an entrance hall which was classed as 'for pub use'. This would limit the use of the entrance hall for residential purposes, but to all intents and purposes, the Tweedales would have achieved 95% of their private house. That would be the end of the Horseshoe Inn as a pub.

  • The proposed bar area would be 19m2. This includes the bar itself and the work area behind it. This would be one of the smallest pubs in England. It would be absurd to suggest that this could be viable as a pub or public bar. There is no provision for the storage of real ales, and in any case, such a small bar would be hardly likely to have the throughput needed to provide real ales. There is not even enough space to offer a reasonable range of drinks.

  • If such a bar ever were opened to the public, it is most likely that it would soon be found to be non-viable, and would then close.
The fact of the matter is that the Tweedales latest application looks like an attempt to obtain change of use by stealth; it would be the end of the pub for ever.

The Tweedales try to suggest that they are the victims, and that CAMRA and HIC are persecuting them. This is a complete distortion of reality: the Tweedales are the predators; the Horseshoe Inn and its surrounding community are their victims.
Why not use the Village Hall as a "pub" instead?

There are practical considerations such as: it is unlicensed; it needs to be booked; it has no regular staff; it has no residual stock.
Apart from that, this is a rather bizarre idea.
How can a pub like the Horseshoe Inn develop trade?

There is a very successful annual poetry festival at nearby Ledbury, and there are other well-advertised local tourist attractions. The pub can be an added attraction for visitors. Rural pubs have a charm of their own, and people seek out those that welcome visitors. There is quite a large local population which could take advantage of a welcoming local pub. Being rural is not necessarily being remote, and there are many thriving pubs which have created a good reputation.
How long will it be before the Horseshoe Inn automatically becomes a private house?

It will be a pub forever, or until planning permission for change of use is given.
Why can't you simply live in the pub as a house without getting "change of use"?

You can to some extent. But, you can't use for domestic purposes the rooms that were "public" rooms; you are supposed to leave them unused.
And, what happens if you do use the "public" rooms for domestic purposes?

The District Council has powers to stop you. Using the "public" rooms for domestic purposes is simply against the law.
Should the Tweedales be forced to run a pub if they don't want to?

Definitely not; no-one should. But that does not mean that they should be able to change its use. They were free to buy the Horseshoe Inn; they are free to sell it. If they don't want to run it, that is what they should do: sell it to someone who wants to run a pub - there are such people out there right now.

The Tweedales could easily have discovered before buying that they would not get change of use; it was against Forest of Dean policy then and it still is. The Tweedales seem to blame the Campaigners for their misfortunes, but even without HIC the Forest of Dean would have rejected the application on planning grounds. The Tweedales could have discovered all this beforehand had they done their homework. Instead, they bought, probably on the assumption that they could bully their way through. It is most unbecoming for them to be continually bleating to the media about how hard done by they are.

The Tweedales have a record for employing bullying tactics. They threatened legal action against members of the Campaign if we continued to use a picture of their house; this was pure bluster with no legal basis. They managed to stop the Dymock Parish Council from commenting on their planning application, for the very dubious reason that the PC had a conflict of interest (in that it owns the freehold of the Beauchamp Arms). They have had the Police threaten members of the Campaign with prosecution for Harassment (again, pure bluster).

The Tweedale camp doesn't stop at putting out false stories, they use the law to bully people who oppose them.

Some people would argue that it is unfair that the Tweedales should have to leave their house. Other people would argue that they should not have bought a pub if they didn't want to own one. It is very hard to be sympathetic towards someone who buys your local pub, closes it, and then expects sympathy for their attempts to close it for ever. The less charitable would argue that this is the unacceptable face of property speculation: the stripping of community assets for private gain - a nice little earner if you can get away with it: their gain; our loss.
What were the planning grounds for turning down the Tweedales' planning application?

We can quote from the Officer's report to the Forest of Dean Development Committee:

"The proposal would result in the loss of a community and service facility in Brooms Green that also serves a wider area to the detriment of social interchange and those visiting the area, contrary to District Local Plan Policy FC.1 which seeks to retain local facilities and services.

"Owing to its location outside of a recognised settlement and not involving the re-use of an existing bed and breakfast accommodation, the proposal would be contrary to Policy FTO.6 of the District Plan and Policy (r) FTRL.2 of the District Local Plan Review.".

Where is the Horseshoe Inn?

It is in Gloucestershire - in Brooms Green - next to the red telephone box.
The map reference is SO715329.
Use this link to get a map.
[last updated on 8 May 2005]    [web page by ]